Q-talk 52 - LETTERS
- Category: Q-Talk Articles
- Published: Friday, 30 June 1995 07:11
- Written by Tom Moore
- Hits: 1813
I have not seen much written about how to put an O235 into a Q bird.
I marveled at the performance of Kimbull McAndrew's Q-235 in Canada and I am sure there must be a few more out there (?). Anyway, this is how I have set about my project.
My first priority was to try and keep the weight down as much as possible. I intend, if cash permits, to use the MT constant speed prop. This weighs 23.5 lbs so this and the heavy Lycoming gave me little choice but to move this mass as far rearwards as possible. I figured the most I could practically move it back was 4", which would require only about 4 lbs of lead at the extreme tail. This was achieved by moving the firewall back by 2". This meant taking 2" off the nose of the canard. The lost strength is to be regained by making an extra spar on the canard leading edge.
The firewall and the mag box was made from 10 lb density foam, all covered with 2 BID and vacuum bagged. I gained the extra 2" by mounting VW engine mounts 1" rearwards, relative to the firewall, the pictures should make it clearer.
By not using the prop extension the Prop flange ends up just about where it does on the VW powered Q's. Unfortunately the Lycoming is somewhat wider at the front, so there was no way of hiding it under a standard cowl! The best I could come up with without having too many bumps and bulges, (well that just would not be British, would it?) can be seen in rough form here.
Looks a bit like a snub-nosed Lancair.
Cheap vacuum bagging. I used a fridge compressor, left running all night to allow the part to cure to at least the green stage.
Peel-Ply the part, next a thin poly sheet with small holes in it. I made a tool for this from a 6" length of broom handle with loads of pins knocked in then cut with wire cutters to the same approximate length. This was then fixed in an old paint roller handle. Place your sheet on corrugated cardboard, roll it over until you have loads of tiny holes in it. Then that goes on top of the Peel-Ply then a sheet of garden scrim (it looks like a heavy tissue to me) then place your top sheet on. I used the same thin poly for both. I sealed it all around with normal plasticine.
This worked well for me, I could not get the air out without using the two middle sheets. I guess it would work OK without Peel-Ply, but I figured that it produces a part that can have secondary bonding or that is almost ready for priming.
As with all things, a word of warning, my bird is far from flying and until it is, I cannot prove that what I have done is safe! Although I have been given help and guidance from my inspector, and the mods have been approved in principle by the PFA, it is subject to probable proof tests. If anybody out there wants to tell me how you are doing yours, please let me know.
Here's to the day it gets off the ground. Good flying to those who have overcome the many slings and arrows of DIY FLY. And have their birds in the air.
To the rest of you, like myself - Stick with It.
Thanks Jim & all you Q builders who have kept me going.
Clive Clapham, Chelmsford, Essex, England
Hello - Quickie Builders
As of January 95, you have a new member, a neophyte builder. I purchased Quickie kit #248 in December of last year, complete less engine & instruments with only the seat constructed. March of this year I took the basic composite construction class offered by Alexander Aeroplane in Seguin - near San Antonio, Texas. When the weather improves I will be going up to Wisconsin to pick it up. With only approximately 1/3 of the newsletters, it will be a necessity to purchase the back issues for construction hints & builder information. This should enable me to build the best plane possible within my abilities. Currently I am moving into my new home (contrary to my mothers & brothers views, this move was not dictated by my lack of garage space - well maybe just a little). I hope the garage will be cleaned out and set up as a construction area before I bring home the kit.
April 29, I met and had a very interesting & informative conversation with Harry Buskey - he even lent me a videotape of his Quickie. If everyone is as helpful as Harry this project will not be a Hangar Queen for the rest of my days. No doubt, in the future you will see my whimpers for help in the newsletter. Looking forward to the Quickie meeting over Labor Day Weekend.
NOTE! GOOD SUGGESTIONS ACCEPTED WITH GRATITUDE.
Mark F. Hawkins, Converse, TX
Hope you are well, I just got Q-Talk #50 and it looked like Sun 'N Fun was enjoyable. I would like to make it back there soon.
A quick update on Tri-Q2353:
I purchased a gallon of the System III primer and like others have found it to work quite well considering my very limited painting skills. I am able to just use the foam rollers provided and with two coats now block sanded on the canard I have a smooth primer coat that I think will suffice for test flights if I get that far ... right now it's the old fill ... sand .. fill .. sand .. primer .. sand ..oops pin holes ..fill sand ...primer. When I get the entire plane in primer, I will update again with amounts required, time spent, etc.
I have also a favor to ask. I believe that I met Mr. Howard Hardy at Ottawa in September 94. He was flying a silver Q-200 with the neatest roll trim device, activated via two interlocking nylon gears on the elevator torque tubes. I have spent the last two months trying to locate the nylon gears that he used at less than $75.00 per gear!! YIKES!! I did ask Howard about it at Ottawa and he seemed to indicate they were easy to find and inexpensive.
I would like to call or write him to get additional information. Would you have his address or phone number?
I would like to chat longer, but the ends of my fingers have healed enough that I think it is time to get back to the sanding. Gotta go.
Dennis Colomb, Vacaville, CA
Ed. Note: Mebbe Howard or you can give us the details for Q-TALK (and, please Lord, even a drawing of the system)! And maybe you purchase a QBA builders roster so you can track down anyone you need for help at your convenience.
I read with interest the letter from Peter Mapes, Bethesda, MD in the last issue (#50). I see many advantages to an aluminum tank over the glass one.
1st - You don't have to worry about all those clogged fuel filters from fibers and flox.
2nd - You don't have to worry about this sealer or that sealer (one for avgas, one for mogas) and whether or not it will really seal your tank. You can use avgas or mogas (even with alcohol in it, if your engine will tolerate it).
I thought I was the only one planning on using aluminum. It should weigh about the same as glass and with proper baffling, support the weight of us heavy's just as well as glass.
Sam Kittle and I worked all last week and now have the wing and ailerons done and ready to mount on the fuselage (except for filling). We will be cutting the foam cores for the LS-1 canard soon. It seems a shame to just throw away a perfectly good GU canard. Do you know anyone who needs one already made with elevators completed too? FOR SALE CHEAP!
I now have an "N" number for my no name project. N89Q will be a TRI-QBARU. We are going with the 118 hp EA-81 instead of the O-200. Hope to have the Tri gear, canard, and wing all mounted by years end. Yeah, I know -- We'll see?
Keep up your legacy of good work on our behalf.
Mike Sorrels, Stockton, CA
Ed. Note: The EA-81 in Reg Clarke's Dragonfly, recently seen at OSH, has been operated some 270+ hours with great success. I think you are on to something good.
Dear Mr. Masal,
Right now I'm waiting for warmer temperatures, so I can get back to work on my canard. I have to admit, after breaking the other canard I built, during load testing (better there than in the air), I lost some of the interest in the project. Even though I've got the new one going, I feel I didn't give it a whole lot of energy. But this year I feel a lot more pumped up about it, and I hope to get a lot more accomplished. Unfortunately, time will tell.
Jim Bates, Lancaster, CA
Ed. Note: And I hope you didn't break a perfectly good canard using a perfectly lousy test procedure. It's been done before!
My medical is gone, my Quickie is for sale. I have decided not to come on board again. Q-TALK was the inspiration for me to keep at C-FOKQ until it was finished. It has logged 68 hrs.
Wm. E. Fisher, Dauphin, Manitoba, Canada
Ed. Note: Thanks, Bill, both for the compliment and for finishing your airplane.
Not much this time for interesting tips. Found an electronic ignition for aircraft for $775.00 per. I talked to a guy who had been flying one for two years and loved it. That's cheaper than the $1100.00 Klaus Savier wants.
Also saw an interesting finishing method in the CSA flyer using just micro, then sand and then about 3 or 4 coats of pure epoxy squeegeed on at 3 to 4 hour intervals. Gives a pure epoxy fill system that might eliminate some paint problems people have had. I really enjoyed the article on the "Bent-C" antenna. Might try it. Well, got to go. Fly safe.
Robert Bounds, Grant, NE
Ed. Note: Leave us not conclude, Bobby, that cheaper is better, eh?
I just haven't had time to work on my Q2, too many other projects. I think I will put it up for sale this year, when I get home to Mich. in June.
I think I will keep my membership in Q-Talk even if I sell. I like the plane and think you do a great job on the newsletter. Thanks for all the help.
Bill Bertrand, Harrison, MI
Ed. Note: A man's gotta know his limits. Thanx for the pat on the back, Bill.
I sold my Q200 Special (56WM) a few years ago. It was flown a total of about 200 hours before being sold to someone in Chino, Calif. and I lost tract of it. I would like to hear what's going on among the builders so include me in.
Bud Meneley, Oceanside, CA
Thanks for the reminder. My wife had been asking for a couple of weeks for the newsletter. She knows about when to expect it and she doesn't like to be kept waiting.
I've had to set the airplane aside for a bit and concentrate on some pressing obligations and Honey Dos that I seem to have let slide for years.
I've hardly even thought about the airplane since December. When I get caught up to where I can give the project some time (and money) again, I've got to get myself up to speed in Citabrias, then a Q2, and hopefully a Q-200 before I decide whether to do my own first flight or get a pro to do it.
Meanwhile I need to read so send me whatever I missed and thanks again.
Bill Dillon, Sonoma, CA
Ed. Note: Lordy, let's don't keep a loyal wife - reader waiting. They are a special group.
Happy New Year Jim,
Even though the FAA grounded me because of cardiac problems and my Quickie #507 is in the state of disrepair, I enjoy reading the Q-TALK. I'm sure I will get my bird up to flying status once more. My AF F-15 nephew wants to keep it flying for me. He originally assisted me in laminating the fuselage skins. I still am amazed at my Quickie's crash worthiness! An ordinary metal-framed A/C would have been completely demolished with a dead pilot in the cockpit. I got out with a few scratches and a stiff neck/back pain from the shoulder harness.
Good luck to everyone, Jim.
Ted Kibiuk - #508, Holland Patent, NY
Ed. Note: Everybody read and heed his last sentence (just above the "Good Luck" part.)
I am renewing my Q-Talk subscription for 1995 and expect to make good building progress in the coming year. Oshkosh was enlightening and also had a few surprises in stock. As I was talking ignitions with Klaus Savier at his VariEze, Burt Rutan and Mike Melvill dropped by for a chat. Hmmmm, you could have knocked me over with a feather.
In this neck of the woods, renovations and the sale of my old house are history and I now have more time to continue my building activities. So things are looking up after all. Thanks for your undying devotion to Q-Talk and QBA; we owe you a great deal. With best wishes for the new year,
Igor Mokrys, Calgary, Canada
Ed. Note: Yeah, I guess my devotion is undying but it is beginning to limp a bit.
Not so sure how to do a 4-3/4 format. Anyway here's my renewal for 1995. Thanks for the back issues and yes, you did send a roster before. Enjoyed the Nov/Dec issue. Still working on the plane. Wheel pants are about done and the main wing is jigged up waiting for fiberglass.
I realize it's very unlikely, but a get together where we could watch/help somebody work on their Q/Q2 would be great.
Farris Wooton, Holts Summit, MO
P.S. (c u on the internet) P.S. Don't bet on it - Ed.
It occurred to me, as I was reading your comments on my letter in the last Q-Talk, that I can't remember any discussion on the subject of engine offset angle. With respect to the centerline of the aircraft, mine was 1" right and 1" down. Perhaps those with no rudder problems use more right offset angle. This would be an interesting parameter to measure, along with wing-canard relative angles of incidence, when determining how well different Qs fly.
With regard to fire safety, every builder should read Ben Owen's column in the November Sport Aviation, pp. 112-113, in which he discusses Halon 1301 central fire suppression systems. Sounds like an awfully good idea to me! Another good idea would be a Nomex fireproof flight suit. The NTSB people told me they are available for under $100, but I don't know where. Anyone knowing a source, please respond!
John S. Derr, Tijeras, NM
Ed. Note: Most auto racers these days wear good fire suits. Drop by your local drag strip, circle track, call your local speed shops or pick up an auto racing magazine and start calling.
We finally sold our Q2 N84RA a year ago. It was FAA signed off, but never flown. We loaded it into a Ryder truck and off to CA it went. One month later we received a video of its first flight. It was a great sight. We have since bought a boat. It flies low and slow, much more suited for a young family of 4.
Thanks for the years of leadership and dedication.
Rod Graham, Issaquah, WA
Ed. Note: Nice to have had you around for a while, Rod. Smooth sailin'!
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